Dire Bitcoin Warning As Confidence ‘Evaporates’ Amid $100 ...

Michael Toomin explains his meltdown, and the structure of Bitcoin Classic (45 min in!)

Michael Toomin explains his meltdown, and the structure of Bitcoin Classic (45 min in!) submitted by brighton36 to Bitcoin [link] [comments]

The Toomin brothers, Bitcoin Classic's main devs are debating Core devs and trying to show them the light. It gets quite fishy at the end.

Join here: http://slack.bitcoincore.org
Start somewhere here: https://bitcoincore.slack.com/archives/general/p1453096627008444
Some extracts:
Michael Toomim [8:06 AM] Satoshi believed the only way to prevent control is to give everyone a copy of the ledger.
[8:06] Give everyone an opportunity to vote.
eric-ledger [8:06 AM] @mtoomim: I think you are delusional
Michael Toomim [8:06 AM] Give everyone an opportunity to transact.
anduck [8:06 AM] mtoomim: bitcoin classic is against that, too.
[8:06] as you very well know.(edited)
Michael Toomim [8:06 AM] We give everyone an opportunity to upgrade the protocol.
Adam Back [8:06 AM] mtoomim: do you understand why the developers of bitcoin used to propose a HF but switched to a SF once it became clear that it was possible because it is safer and faster?
Michael Toomim [8:06 AM] You can take part in bitcoin.
[8:06] You can add yourself to it.
[8:06] Express yourself on consider.it.
anduck [8:06 AM] are you a bot?
Michael Toomim [8:07 AM] Are you a bot?
dts [8:07 AM] I'm convinced, I welcome our new pot smoking master
James Hillard [8:07 AM] @opet: when did I ever refer to you as being part of the uneducated masses?
Michael Toomim [8:07 AM] Do you wanna speak bot? Bleep Bleep Bloop!
[8:07] 1010111
Adam Back [8:07 AM] opet: "it's an image and communication problem." this is agreed
Michael Toomim [8:07 AM] What's your favorite wave? Mine's triangle.
eric-ledger [8:07 AM] you sound like a cultist
anduck [8:07 AM] mtoomim: quit advertising your platform
Michael Toomim [8:07 AM] Haha I'm just stoned guys.
Adam Back [8:07 AM] lol
Michael Toomim [8:07 AM] Cultists do get stoned a lot.
[8:07] But I'm just stoned.
Adam Back [8:07 AM] mtoomim: are you serious?
Michael Toomim [8:07 AM] You're mistaking correlation with causation.
dts [8:07 AM] If any miners are here, please pay attention to @mtoomim words
Michael Toomim [8:07 AM] Yes I'm serious. Do you not believe me? Test me!
anduck [8:08 AM] mtoomim: so how much did you pay the miners? 0 or more
Michael Toomim [8:08 AM] I'd love more attention. I love attention!
[8:08] What? I ​am​ the miner!
[8:08] https://toom.im Toomim Bros. Bitcoin Mining Concern Toomim Bros. provides hosting for bitcoin mining. Our mining center is powered by some of the most wallet- and climate-friendly power in the world.
eric-ledger [8:08 AM] meltdown
anduck [8:08 AM] as stated earlier, it's a valid concern that you may have paid miners. you offered money to other to do things that people have been doing for NO money earlier.
Michael Toomim [8:08 AM] I pay myself every day.
anduck [8:08 AM] @mtoomim: did the miners get paid to express support for Classic or not?
Adam Back [8:08 AM] mtoomim: are you literally stoned? you may want to unplug for a while.
Nicolas Bacca [8:09 AM] At that point I think the best course of action is to demonstrate to the miners that segwit works well with multiple wallets and that well, one team is slightly more serious than the other one.
Michael Toomim [8:09 AM] No they didn't get paid. Duh. The miners have all the money. They are the ones who pay.
dts [8:09 AM] It is legal in Washington State as far as I know
taek [8:09 AM] @mtoomim: you keep trying to flatter us. We don't work for free. We are not impressed with the direction you are taking things and we don't feel inclined to work on your vision. Ours is in the process of being shredded to pieces, why do you think we will maintain morale and motivation?
James Hillard [8:09 AM] I hardly consider a sub MW mining operation to be much of anything at this point.
taek [8:09 AM] ugh
anduck [8:09 AM] mtoomim: thanks
Michael Toomim [8:09 AM] Yeah it's legal here. 1
Colin Delargy [8:09 AM] I don’t think I could think of something more off topic. 1
Michael Toomim [8:09 AM] @taek I don't give the vision. YOU give the vision. Come give it.
[8:09] I just create a place for you to talk and listen.
dts [8:09 AM] @mtoomim: you really aren't doing yourself any favors
Michael Toomim [8:10 AM] I'm hosting the forum.
eric-ledger [8:10 AM] this is insane
p2phash [8:10 AM] funny though
dts [8:10 AM] I hope this is saved for posterity
Adam Back [8:10 AM] mtoomim: i dont think yes. i think you should go sleep it off.
Michael Toomim [8:10 AM] This is great! I love this conversation guys!
eric-ledger [8:10 AM] doe anyone know for sure he is the real Michael Toomim?
Michael Toomim [8:10 AM] You are real fun.
dts [8:10 AM] he verified his email as the same one on Classic Slack
Michael Toomim [8:10 AM] Nobody texted me.
[8:10] :stuck_out_tongue:
gamersg [8:10 AM] mtoomim: If SW via SF increases effective block size to 2MB, why are you pushing for a 2MB HF (honest qsn)
Michael Toomim [8:10 AM] Text me a random code at +++++++++++++
Adam Back [8:11 AM] eric-ledger: oh maybe it's a look alike account.
dts [8:11 AM] why do you have an Oakland number
Michael Toomim [8:11 AM] Because the people who voted aren't pushing for it.
[8:11] I went to school at uc berkeley.
Colin Delargy [8:11 AM] content style matches https://www.reddit.com/usetoomim reddit: the front page of the internet
p2phash [8:11 AM] @gamersg: not a full 2mb of transactions really is it?
anduck [8:11 AM] gamersg: that's been asked like hundred times. he refuses to answer.
taek [8:11 AM] I do feel like I've been properly baited. @mtoomim: my vision is a cryptocurrency that is immune to political influence. That vision does not seem to be present in the current ecosystem
Michael Toomim [8:11 AM] @dts are you nearby?
dts [8:11 AM] that explains the pot
Michael Toomim [8:12 AM] haha Yeah it does.
[8:12] And acid
judahmu [8:12 AM] we liked dts better as luke-jr
dts [8:12 AM] I'm flattered
James Hillard [8:12 AM] Is this what future bitcoin development conversations are going to look like? 1
dts [8:12 AM] Yes he is the real deal, not a troll, kind of unbelievable
James Hillard [8:13 AM] This is insane
oneeman [8:13 AM] tomorrow is a holiday
taek [8:13 AM] :}
dts [8:13 AM] He did go to UC berkeley and slack sends you an email to verify it
oneeman [8:13 AM] as good a day as any to cut loose, I guess
drdave [8:14 AM] joined #general
Adam Back [8:15 AM] are we sure mtoomim is actually michael toomim? wasnt it toomim before?
anduck [8:15 AM] it's michael toomim
[8:15] changed nick to mtoomim
Brian Hoffman [8:15 AM] What a cluster fuck
Michael Toomim [8:15 AM] @taek There are politics in every social system. Our job is to improve them. That's why we made Bitcoin Classic. The problem with politics is that they get in the way, and so make political communication more efficient, so it gets out of the way.
Adam Back [8:16 AM] anduck: well he said that, but what if that itself was a spoof?
anduck [8:16 AM] @adam3us: the email looks legit, at least
Adam Back [8:16 AM] mtoomim: what hashrate does toom.im have?
Michael Toomim [8:16 AM] We are the first forum that can visualize over 1,000 opinions on a single page.
dts [8:16 AM] less than 1%
Michael Toomim [8:16 AM] We scale.
Adam Back [8:16 AM] so email him a code see if he can answer it?
Luke-Jr [8:16 AM] what's the invite link again?
Michael Toomim [8:16 AM] @adam3us: We only have a small amount. Most of our capacity goes to customers who host with us.
Adam Back [8:16 AM] slack.bitcoincore.org
Michael Toomim [8:17 AM] We have 750 kW of power capacity.
dino_m [8:17 AM] joined #general
dts [8:17 AM] @btcdrak: should put it on the front page of bitcoincore.org :confused:
Luke-Jr [8:17 AM] thx. what is the share rules for this link?
dts [8:17 AM] it's posted already on there just hidden behind "contribute"
Luke-Jr [8:17 AM] k, so public
Michael Toomim [8:17 AM] So you can multiply 750 kW by the average efficiency to get the hashrate at our facility.
kang [8:18 AM] joined #general
Michael Toomim [8:18 AM] Text me it's faster.
Patrick Strateman [8:18 AM] @mtoomim: well divide by x and carry the... <1%
oneeman [8:18 AM] someone in ##bitcoin asked a day or two ago if maybe bitcoin classic was just a viral marketing ploy for consider.it ... 2
Michael Toomim [8:18 AM] Probably
anduck [8:19 AM] oneeman: well it certainly looks like so
[8:19] mtoomim has advertised it like 10 times in an hour
oneeman [8:19 AM] I thought the question was a joke, but now I'm not so sure
anduck [8:19 AM] and nobody still cares about it.
Michael Toomim [8:19 AM] And we're all a viral marketing campaign for bitcoin! 2
Patrick Strateman [8:19 AM] @oneeman: lold
Michael Toomim [8:19 AM] Ok what am I not answering now?
anduck [8:19 AM] mtoomim: read the log.
[8:19] please.
Michael Toomim [8:19 AM] Come on!
Adam Back [8:19 AM] mtoomim: nice. yes coincidentally i had looked at your hosting service for some miners i had a while back.
Michael Toomim [8:19 AM] It's so long
[8:19] You talk fast
[8:20] I've responded very well to everything I've been able to tackle
anduck [8:20 AM] you're already deeming others to do the btc deving work for you, don't make us read the logs you should read(edited)
Michael Toomim [8:20 AM] I want you to choose
[8:20] There are a lot of options up there
Patrick Strateman [8:20 AM] @mtoomim: Would you be OK with a world in which virtually all Bitcoin users run SPV clients and only a handful of trusted third parties operate full nodes?
alie1 [8:20 AM] joined #general
Michael Toomim [8:20 AM] You get power, you can choose what I talk about!
[8:20] Good question!
[8:21] Ok, so I need to answer this well. Give me these numbers:
  1. The percent of SPV clients
  2. The number of full nodes
[8:21] I'll give you my opinion.
James Hillard [8:21 AM] toomims hosting service is small peanuts in the scheme of things, I manage multiple MW scale large farms in multiple countries and even then have only about 1% of network hashpower
Michael Toomim [8:21 AM] Good job James!
[8:21] Congratulations!
epscy [8:22 AM] joined #general
Michael Toomim [8:22 AM] Hey can someone get Greg Maxwell? I love that guy!
Patrick Strateman [8:22 AM] @mtoomim: 100 full nodes run by say blockstream, coinbase, mit, etc etc everybody else runs spv clients
Michael Toomim [8:22 AM] I want him to work with Classic!
Adam Back [8:22 AM] mtoomim: i sent you an email to auth your slack handle here
dts [8:22 AM] yeah verify
Adam Back [8:22 AM] can you paste or type the code in
dts [8:23 AM] otherwise bravo on excellent trolling
taek [8:23 AM] @phantomcircuit: I don't think conversation with mtoomim is going to go anywhere.
Michael Toomim [8:23 AM] uploaded an image: Cool! Add Comment
dts [8:23 AM] it's listed as his email in the classic slack
Adam Back [8:23 AM] ok then. that's pretty confirmed.
Michael Toomim [8:23 AM] Fuck yeah it is!
Oliver [8:23 AM] @jameshilliard you inadvertently did so when you referred to those voting on consider.it and supporting Classic as the "uneducated masses."
After all, I didn't give up my anonymity and finally get involved with bitcoin dev in any way until Classic arrived on the scene.
There are many more exactly like me who have signed up to finally have our voices heard and votes counted. Some, like me, are incredibly sick of (and saddened) by the Core devs' seeming ignorance of the fact that it's NOT ok to completely ignore the wants of the community.
I'm here now, and I'm here to help. My greatest desire is to somehow help bring Core and Classic together with a compromise. I'd like to see collaboration and an understanding that the road map requires a lot more than Core's blessing.(edited)
Michael Toomim [8:23 AM] That's like, real!
[8:23] It'd be so hard for me to photoshop that in 50 seconds
[8:24] Photoshop sucks
[8:24] I can do better in omnigraffle
[8:24] and built-in OSX screenshotting
[8:24] @phantomcircuit: That scenario is fucked up, dude! Everybody runs an SPV client? Sounds like fucking fascist china man!
Luke-Jr [8:24 AM] considering how quickly my PR for Classic was shot down without discussion...
frankenmint [8:24 AM] joined #general
Michael Toomim [8:25 AM] I lived in china for 6 months man, it wasn't pretty with the government
[8:25] I'm so glad the chinese are finding freedom with bitcoin
eric-ledger [8:25 AM] @mtoomim: You should come back when you are not stoned; you are not helping yourself 3
Michael Toomim [8:25 AM] They need it!
Luke-Jr [8:25 AM] lol
dts [8:25 AM] uploaded an image: Here is his email listed in classic slack Add Comment Michael Toomim [8:25 AM] @eric-ledger: I'm loving this conversation!
[8:25] I'm here to help you guys!
eric-ledger [8:25 AM] well I do also love it
James Hillard [8:25 AM] @opet: I didn't mean to imply that everyone voting on there is uneducated.
Michael Toomim [8:25 AM] I want to make it easier to dev bitcoin!
eric-ledger [8:25 AM] but it may come back and bite you in the ass
Michael Toomim [8:26 AM] Haha
[8:26] That would be fun!
[8:26] Like a snake.
Patrick Strateman [8:26 AM] @mtoomim: Do you not realize that scenario is exactly the one you're moving towards with classic?
Michael Toomim [8:26 AM] Woah! No I don't!
[8:26] Please tell me how that's happening!
[8:26] How are we going to force everyone to use SPV clients?
[8:27] That means that we have to force people not to run a full node.
[8:27] Right now it's pretty easy to run a full node.
[8:27] I run one on this laptop.
[8:27] My laptop's only getting bigger and better every year.
[8:27] And the democracy cares about this!
[8:27] They won't let full nodes stop running on their laptops.
elliotolds [8:27 AM] @opet: what do you think as this (proposed earlier by someone else here) for a compromise: in April we hard fork to 2 MB, then we do segwit later in the year, maybe October or something, but whenever Core is comfortable releasing it? (sooner is fine, even along with the April HF is OK if they want it then)
Michael Toomim [8:27 AM] They want full nodes to run on their laptops!
[8:27] They want it so bad!
Patrick Strateman [8:27 AM] @mtoomim: so four or five tabs? 4
Michael Toomim [8:27 AM] I want it so bad!
[8:27] I love bitcoin on my laptop!
[8:28] It's like a girlfriend in your lap!
[8:28] Isn't it?
eric-ledger [8:28 AM] omg
Michael Toomim [8:28 AM] Who wants to relegate her to the server room?
dinbits [8:28 AM]
I'm here to help you guys! @mtoomim: Do you plan on saying anything helpful?(edited)
Michael Toomim [8:28 AM] That's for herems.
[8:28] I support sexual equality!
[8:28] @dinbits I want to be helpful! What would you like me to help you with?
jdebunt [8:28 AM] joined #general
Michael Toomim [8:28 AM] Or help other people with?
dts [8:29 AM] what he's saying is very illuminating to me 3
Michael Toomim [8:29 AM] @phantomcircuit: I once took 4 tabs and went free-diving off the coast of hawaii.
[8:29] Kapoho tide pools on the big island
[8:29] That was so great!
[8:29] I saw fish world.
[8:29] Like the clan of the little cute white fish with the red stripe that swish you left and right.
[8:29] I came up speaking in a new style. 1 1
justino [8:30 AM] joined #general
Michael Toomim [8:30 AM] Every once in a while my words would disiintegrate into strange snap crackle popping, the sounds of fish world.
[8:30] I called it a flubbergust.
[8:30] It is the moment where your spirit veers into void and disappears.
[8:30] It's when you are wrong.
[8:30] In Bitcoin, we have a problem of admitting when we're wrong.
[8:30] Because there's no data on it.
elliotolds [8:30 AM] I wonder if this is some sort of Machiavellian plot, and later Jonathan will come in here and seem like the most reasonable person in the world in comparison 3
Michael Toomim [8:30 AM] We're giving you social data.
[8:30] bitcoin.consider.it
Nathan Cook [8:30 AM] shh, this is great
Michael Toomim [8:30 AM] It tells you when you're right and wrong
[8:31] So that you can learn
[8:31] When you learn, you get better
[8:31] And you get shit done
[8:31] You can make changes to bitcoin
dts [8:31 AM] I still can't quite believe it's you even with the proof
Michael Toomim [8:31 AM] We are hardforking the blocksize limit to 2mb
[8:31] Join us.
anduck [8:31 AM] why not 6 mb?
Adam Back [8:31 AM] i think it's him
anduck [8:31 AM] it would allow more transactions
Michael Toomim [8:31 AM] @dts wanna video chat me?
Nicolas Bacca [8:31 AM] is there drug for everybody ?
dts [8:31 AM] like my mind can't make the two parts fit together
eric-ledger [8:31 AM] a selfie maybe?
Michael Toomim [8:31 AM] Guys come meet me in tawk.space. I'll be online in 5 minutes.
taek [8:31 AM] Things have gotten terribly off topic, I would like to request that people stop responding to the nonsense, and also stop encouraging it. There is more valuable conversation that is being blocked by the ridiculousness happening right now.
Michael Toomim [8:32 AM] That's https://tawk.space. Use chrome or go home.
dts [8:32 AM] let's rename this chat mtoomim's magical bus trip and make a new channel 4
kang [8:32 AM] Not before that selfie plz
Michael Toomim [8:33 AM] hahaha
jake7849 [8:33 AM] joined #general
alie1 [8:33 AM] is this a joke ?
jwade [8:34 AM] joined #general
Michael Toomim [8:34 AM] Fuck! Tawk.space is down! Karthik!!!!!!!!
[8:34] Can we make a group video chat in skype?
[8:34] Oh a hangout
submitted by bahatassafus to btc [link] [comments]

ETC should NOT be trying to distinguish itself with its own dev team, its own roadmap, etc

I am starting to see the ETC make the same mistake that caused Bitcoin Classic to lose support: focusing on differences other than the one which is the entire reason for the project's existence.
People are largely drawn to ETC because they oppose the bailout. They believe ETC is Ethereum, and ETHF is a compromised imitation of the real Ethereum.
The more other junk gets added to the ETC message, the lower the support will be.
If ETC becomes the dominant chain, Vitalik and all the other prominent Ethereum folks will start treating ETC as the real fork. There is no need to create a new dev roadmap. Focusing on differences other than "ETC is the real chain, ETHF is the bailout chain" will just dilute the message.
Once ETC becomes dominant, that is the time for the discussion in the entire Ethereum community to turn to any change in dev direction that the community wants.
I personally am happy with Vitalik and the rest of the devs, except for their decision to support ETHF. If it becomes a matter of me having to support Vitalik and the old devs vs. some ragtag group of devs that come out of the woodwork now, my support for ETC gets significantly weaker. Again, this is a false choice because the ETHF devs will become ETC devs if ETC wins.
Brief history lesson: Bitcoin Classic initially had a lot of support from miners, exchanges, and users for their Core idea: "upgrade the existing Bitcoin network to 2 MB blocks." However, things started going south when the Toomim brothers mistook support for Bitcoin Classic for support for their other ideas about Bitcoin governance and what the dev roadmap should be.
Miners, businesses, and investors looked at Toomim's community voting site to determine the direction of the project, and looked at the people who were leading Classic in a different direction (especially Jonathan's brother, Michael Toomim), and said "No thanks. I like the 2 MB block size idea, but I don't want these people changing all this other stuff."
The ETC community doesn't need to make investors choose between different dev teams. ETC can win this battle by focusing on the fundamental choice of "do you think the bailout chain should be the main chain, or the original chain?"
submitted by go1111111 to EthereumClassic [link] [comments]

Bitcoin Classic is being attacked, have you noticed?

The opposition has clearly stepped up their propaganda attacks on Bitcoin Classic in the past day or two. Why? Because Classic is supposed to release this week.
Some examples:
https://www.reddit.com/btc/comments/42kiux/give_coinbase_full_control_over_bitcoin/
https://www.reddit.com/btc/comments/42jlh2/great_bitcoin_uncensored_interview_michael_toomin/
https://www.reddit.com/Bitcoin/comments/42kz2a/exclusive_tour_of_toomim_bros_mining_facility/
https://www.reddit.com/btc/comments/42gx07/are_bitcoin_classic_developers_receiving_threats/
https://www.reddit.com/Bitcoin_Classic/comments/42kbof/considerit_is_experiencing_an_attack/
https://www.reddit.com/btc/comments/42eh5g/bitcoin_core_developers_controversial_algorithm/
https://www.reddit.com/btc/comments/42c6olesson_learned_from_the_classic_coup_attempt_o
https://www.reddit.com/btc/comments/428aae/influential_bitcoin_core_developer_proposes/
submitted by Gobitcoin to btc [link] [comments]

People supporting Bitcoin Classic is growing and growing by the day!

From the bitcoin classic website:
submitted by Gobitcoin to Bitcoin_Classic [link] [comments]

bitcoin classic drug fueled meltdown

Please stop censorship on btc paging memorydealers your mods censored this.
http://pastebin.com/DPPs7qtc
Michael Toomim [9:57 PM] Guys, just a minute. gotta pack a bowl with my host here.
Michael Toomim [10:07 PM] Haha I'm just stoned guys.
Michael Toomim [10:12 PM] haha Yeah it does.
[10:12] And acid
see pastebin
note BitcoinXio this is not fake do not censor, mtoomim authenticated himself on the channel and even replied on reddit in the thread before censore.
submitted by spotTheF3d to btc [link] [comments]

De naked put als optiestrategie - deel 12 ANUPDATED ROOM TOUR YouTube CoinSpice Podcast 30 Jonathan Toomim Bitcoin - YouTube

Michael toomim, principal proponente do bitcoin classic e irmão do desenvolvedor principal, recentemente fez comentários esclarecedores em um canal de desenvolvedor slack dedicado ao bitcoin core. leia também: knc miner endorses bitcoin classic o toomim foi associado estreitamente ao novo cliente bitcoin que pretende ser a solução que a bitcoin precisa para se equilibrar em meio ao seu ... Michael toomim, glavni zagovornik bitcoin classic i brat glavnog developera, nedavno je napravio prosvjetljujuće komentare u programu slack razvojnog kanala posvećenom bitcoin core-u. također čita: knc miner podržava bitcoin classic toomim je blisko povezan s najnovijim bitcoin klijentom koji je bitko rješenje koje bitcoin treba kako bi se izmjerio tijekom rasprave o veličini bloka. Michael Toomim, Hauptvertreter von Bitcoin Classic und Bruder des Hauptentwicklers, machte kürzlich aufschlussreiche Kommentare in einem Slack-Entwicklerkanal, der Bitcoin Core gewidmet ist. Lesen Sie auch: KnC Miner unterstützt Bitcoin Classic. Toomim wurde eng mit dem neuesten Bitcoin-Client in Verbindung gebracht, der angeblich die Lösung ist, die Bitcoin benötigt, um im Rahmen seiner ... After bitcoin and crypto markets saw some $100 billion worth of value erased in just a week, bitcoin bull and hedge fund multi-millionaire Mike Novogratz has warned confidence has "evaporated ... Great Bitcoin Uncensored interview: Michael Toomin talks about his skills and governance structure of Bitcoin Classic (45 min in)

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De naked put als optiestrategie - deel 12

Hola lovelys today viedos is a toom tour make sure to come back everyweek for more viedos. Bitcoin Cash Difficulty Adjustment Algorithm Development Meeting; discuss progress in developing, reviewing and implementing a new BCH DAA in the different implementations. July 27th 2020, 19:00 ... Skip navigation Sign in. Search Skip navigation Sign in. Search Auf YouTube findest du großartige Videos und erstklassige Musik. Außerdem kannst du eigene Inhalte hochladen und mit Freunden oder mit der ganzen Welt teilen.

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